tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post1058452366719712584..comments2022-08-26T12:51:41.449-04:00Comments on Teach Game Design: Victory conditions summary for boardgames/cardgamesLewis Pulsipherhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-28810679223827434832015-10-19T20:09:42.656-04:002015-10-19T20:09:42.656-04:00Not surprising when someone, without substantiatio...Not surprising when someone, without substantiation, resorts to name-calling, that they hide behind "anonymous". You've joined the "noisy majority" who tend to make the Internet an unpleasant place while adding nothing useful to it, congratulations whoever-you-are.Lewis Pulsipherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-37978272666406549982015-10-19T19:21:12.507-04:002015-10-19T19:21:12.507-04:00I had forgotten this entire conversation, not surp...I had forgotten this entire conversation, not surprisingly. Yet the point is that and/or does not clarify, it confuses. It means the same as or alone, so when people see and/or enough, they think or must mean something else. <br /><br />A great many changes in language derive from sheer ignorance. It's hardly like people are getting better at using the language, rather they're getting Lewis Pulsipherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-51166800367416851782015-10-19T18:48:07.042-04:002015-10-19T18:48:07.042-04:00I came down to the comments hoping for further int...I came down to the comments hoping for further intelligent, relevant discussion of win conditions. Instead I found the pig-headed author angrily defending his position that writing conventions that quickly clarify meaning are moronic and/or lazy. I am disappointed. <br /><br />To make my comment less infuriating for you to read, Lewis, let me remove all the unnecessary words for you: hoping for Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-460279117916874122015-10-19T18:42:25.086-04:002015-10-19T18:42:25.086-04:00Came down to the comments hoping to find further d...Came down to the comments hoping to find further discussion of win conditions. Instead found the pig-headed author angrily defending his position that writing conventions that clarify meaning are moronic and/or lazy. I am disappointed.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09635670967705999208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-32205477486569248842008-03-14T13:15:00.000-04:002008-03-14T13:15:00.000-04:00Since "or" has meant "one or the other or both" fo...Since "or" has meant "one or the other or both" for centuries, I'd suggest the following:<BR/><BR/>If you mean to use "or" as an exclusive or, the modified form should be as below.<BR/><BR/>"...and for your meat you may select EITHER chicken or steak."<BR/><BR/>You don't modify things by inventing a new word (and/or), you use an existing well-known form to show exclusivity.<BR/><BR/>"And/or" is aLewis Pulsipherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-66905952080980200942008-03-14T11:05:00.000-04:002008-03-14T11:05:00.000-04:00In everyday usage the specific meaning of the word...In everyday usage the specific meaning of the word 'or' is indicated by its context. Sometimes it can be ambiguous and should be clarified with an extra word or words.<BR/><BR/>Used in an 'If' statement to present multiple conditions it means one or both conditions. e.g. "If you have a red card or a blue card you may play." <BR/><BR/>Used to present multiple choices the word means either choice Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-54495666854303323702008-03-12T09:18:00.000-04:002008-03-12T09:18:00.000-04:00To start off the rules writing guide, you can have...To start off the rules writing guide, you can have a look here:<BR/><BR/>http://www.sjgames.com/general/guidelines/authors/style.html<BR/><BR/>But check this out:<BR/><BR/>In the glossary at the bottom, the site states:<BR/>"and/or. <BR/>Use only when necessary - and it almost never is. The words are separated by a slash and no space. These are the only two words treated this way."<BR/><BR/>Yet, Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-47873158674243991242008-03-11T10:41:00.000-04:002008-03-11T10:41:00.000-04:00A rules-writing guide? That's not such a bad idea...A rules-writing guide? That's not such a bad idea (you'd think one exists somewhere).<BR/><BR/>I've put the following at the start of my recent rules drafts:<BR/><BR/> (Note about nomenclature: the word "or" is used in these rules in the original (and the programming) sense, to mean "one or the other or both"--exactly the same meaning as "and/or".)<BR/><BR/>Assuming I understand what and/or Lewis Pulsipherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-10951822004253436192008-03-11T10:36:00.000-04:002008-03-11T10:36:00.000-04:00I was shocked the first time I heard someone say "...I was shocked the first time I heard someone say "that's gay". And especially when I heard my 13-year-old niece say it, somewhat later. But I've been around teens and 20-somethings a lot, as a college teacher, and when I talk to them about it, they really do NOT have homosexuals in mind, even though that's undoubtedly where the phrase came from. It doesn't even occur to many of them, when theyLewis Pulsipherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-33435008143866482502008-03-11T09:07:00.000-04:002008-03-11T09:07:00.000-04:00I am amazed that after considerable googling, how ...I am amazed that after considerable googling, how difficult it is to find a good definition or usage of the word OR. (It doesn’t help that the search engine seems to prefer to use the OR as an operation rather than an inquiry. I think that’s actually pretty funny.) And you are correct, dictionary.com is not helpful—shame on them. <BR/><BR/>I found some legal usage manuals that discourage it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-74545773573822460352008-03-11T09:06:00.000-04:002008-03-11T09:06:00.000-04:00With respect, there is no comparison of the usage ...With respect, there is no comparison of the usage of the word OR with the usage of the word GAY. The usage of the word GAY by young people, and not so young people for that matter, to mean “I don’t like that” is at its core derogatory. The embedded connotation of this phase is, “If you like that, you are a homosexual and all the bad things associated with being so.” It is a form of hate speechAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-12645004423219817492008-03-10T22:18:00.000-04:002008-03-10T22:18:00.000-04:00Haven't taken a poll in some years, at that time, ...Haven't taken a poll in some years, at that time, the majority did not misunderstand the word, though many did<BR/><BR/>I confess I have never heard anyone involved in rules writing advocate adopting a new meaning of a word when so many people still understand it as the old meaning.<BR/><BR/>Shall we use "gay" to mean "I don't like that", which is the common way young people use it, even though Lewis Pulsipherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-26682365315884161712008-03-10T19:37:00.000-04:002008-03-10T19:37:00.000-04:00The trouble with 'or' as defined in terms of a pro...The trouble with 'or' as defined in terms of a programmer's point of view, is that most non-programmers no longer see the word to mean: "one or the other or both"; the word has evolved to have the sense of mutual exclusivity. <BR/><BR/>One problem is that common usage is no longer utilizing the word 'either' as necessary for mutual exclusivity, so 'or' used alone has somehow defaulted to Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-75955337262001749452008-03-09T09:30:00.000-04:002008-03-09T09:30:00.000-04:00Well, I was an adult when "and/or" began to be use...Well, I was an adult when "and/or" began to be used commonly. And in programming, "OR" is definitely "one or the other or both", not the XOR ("but not both"). That meaning *isn't* going to change.<BR/><BR/>My wife had a professor once who forced her to use "and/or" instead of "or" in a paper. What a moron. Perhaps that's given me strong feelings about it.<BR/><BR/>So despite "confusion of Lewis Pulsipherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-17927116869406217562008-03-09T06:48:00.000-04:002008-03-09T06:48:00.000-04:00ehanuise :Use 'or' in a game rulesbook to mean and...ehanuise :<BR/>Use 'or' in a game rulesbook to mean and/or and you're bound to have an <BR/>errata or faq the day it gets on the shelves, however.<BR/><BR/>I can see the rules lawyers jumping on the "a or b means 'either a or either b but not both' otherwise they'd have used and/or" argument already.<BR/><BR/>In a general sense you're right, of course, but in the strictly technical lingo of gamesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-56690859268318663612008-03-08T20:58:00.000-05:002008-03-08T20:58:00.000-05:00Yes, that would seem to be a form of "accumulate"....Yes, that would seem to be a form of "accumulate".<BR/><BR/>Pedantic comment: "And/or" and "or" mean exactly the same thing. "And/or" is a fairly recent perpetration of ignorance. "Or" means "one or the other or both", it is not an "exclusive or" in programming terms, which would be "one or the other but not both".Lewis Pulsipherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11998403221823705918noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-27927665471479947522008-03-08T15:57:00.000-05:002008-03-08T15:57:00.000-05:00Where would "pick up and deliver" games fit in? I...Where would "pick up and deliver" games fit in? I'm thinking "Accumulate something [and/or] get rid of something". with my suggested modification of and/or.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2167431351409795343.post-22414662238160121402007-11-28T12:34:00.000-05:002007-11-28T12:34:00.000-05:00'Occupy a position' is also often accompanied by a...'Occupy a position' is also often accompanied by a duration (1 turn, ...) to even out pyrric attacks.ehanuisehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13014268838551121822noreply@blogger.com